MJ calls what happened to her in Zion national park “small ‘T’ trauma”. She knows women have experienced worse from their partners. But she still feels the anger of being left behind on a hike by her now ex. “It brings up stuff in my body that maybe I have not cleared out yet,” she said.
Five years ago, MJ and a new partner – he was not exactly her boyfriend, and the pair were not exclusive – traveled from Los Angeles to Utah for an adventure getaway. MJ, who is 38 and works in PR, was looking forward to exploring Zion’s striking scenery; its vast sandstone canyon and pristine wading trails were on the list. But on the morning of their big hike, MJ was not feeling well. She could not shake the feeling that something was “off”; indeed, MJ would learn on this trip that her partner was seeing other women.
As they made their way up Angel’s Landing, MJ’s partner started walking faster than her. “I could tell it was getting on his nerves that I was slow,” she said. “I was like, ‘Fuck it, just go ahead of me.’” He did without hesitation.
When she caught up at the top of the mountain, they took a picture together. Then her partner hiked down the mountain with a woman he had met on the way up, leaving MJ to finish by herself. They broke up shortly after that trip. (MJ asked to be referred to by her initials for the sake of speaking openly about a past relationship.)
Last month, MJ opened TikTok and heard the phrase “alpine divorce”, a label she now attaches to her experience in Zion.
You already agreed with me that this thread shows that the men in here, on Lemmy, do not respect women’s perspectives of abuse.
I’ve been on this earth about 40 years. I am fully aware of how most men are, not just online, but in person as well. Women’s lived experiences dealing with men are often dismissed, as they are here, so I don’t expect less from you to be honest.
And I say this as a woman who loves men. I have a lot of good and kind men in my life that I love dearly. But they tend to be exceptions with how they treat women. And Lemmy has continued to show me this truth.
Edit: It’s actually really topical that this hit the news yesterday as well -
Yes, I agree that the amount of men who treat women badly or don’t respect them as people or their opinions is concerningly high in this thread, and IRL as well tbh.
My argument is exclusively that expressing that sentiment by making a generalized statement about “men on lemmy” is incorrect (it does not apply to the entire group) and immoral (you are talking badly about some people who do not deserve it by applying a property of one of their identity groups to every member of that group individually). But again, “not all men” vs “too many men” has been discussed to death already so I don’t think I’m really adding anything new here.
Edit: Just saw your edit. My sympathies to Dolores Huerta. Even men who do good things can be revealed to have evil within them.
You’re ignoring that we can see what the majority of men are upvoting and contributing to on Lemmy.
If even Cesar Chavez is still a man who will take from women what he wants, then why would women see a man who is a leftist as better than others?
I’m not ignoring that, and women should not see a leftist man as significantly less potentially dangerous than any other. I’m saying that regardless of what percentage of people in an identity group have a certain quality, it is wrong to make an unqualified statement about that group, or to assume an individual within that group must have similar qualities to the average member of it. That is the very basis of why racism, sexism, anti-lgbt sentiment, even microaggressions, etc. are wrong, but it applies to men too.
They made a generalized comment about the men on Lemmy, not men in general.
Edit: The men on Lemmy tend to be more left and progressive and they use that as a shield to say they’re better than conservatives. But there is one blind spot that is very common, common enough that a generalization rings true - women.
That’s true, it’s kind of a grey area. I could see it being argued either way whether it’s an identity group given it’s defined by both identity and choice. I guess it’s not? I still think it would be better not to make a generalization like that, given you will be ascribing negative qualities to people who do not deserve it, but I’m splitting hairs at this point. The sentiment expressed had value I suppose.
If I said that the women who participate in the 4B movement by and large hate men, that is an accurate generalization.
If the men on Lemmy don’t want to be seen as misogynists, then they should put in the work to comment opposite of those views and they should hold people espousing those views as accountable as they do women who are rightfully upset at being blamed for all of men’s wrong-doings.
Fair enough. I think that does happen, it’s just that that doesn’t eliminate the people who are making sexist comments. I do think there’s a difference between someone who’s a part of an ideological movement (their chosen group clearly expresses their views) and someone who is just using a particular website for various reasons (their choice to use that website does not imply general agreement with the website’s views) but I see your point.
People who make sexist comments will never be reduced to zero, but it would sure be awesome to not see those comments with dozens of upvotes.
It’s the support those comments receive that lead me to believe the men on Lemmy are overwhelmingly misogynists.